Here’s part three of our interview with @thebwack. We chat about the making of Church Music and how the Crowder Band approaches using loops. Before you check out the article make sure to check out Part 1, and Part 2.
What role do loops play in the Crowder Band? How do you guys treat the idea of using loops?
It’s totally different for every song. I think our philosophy is that we’re going to try and perform as much as we can live. For me as a drummer its just another way of looking at drums. I guess for me the role is subdivisions, its like adding a whole lot of cool subdivisions, and layers. You know in the studio I really like the sound of two or three drumsets all playing at once, so alot of times the loop is either other drum kit parts i’ve recorded or extra beats that I’ve programmed. Alot of it is just trying to get that electronic or urban sound. And for me its a way to play on the beat a little more.. I don’t want to feel restricted to the feeling that if I’m not laying down the backbeat, no one is. I want to feel like if I want to go away from that and not lay down that strong backbeat I know that the loop is providing that.
This record is kinda the first record where we are really starting to blur the line between the drummer and the band and the loops. The way we are performing it, there’s really not that division anymore. There are so many elements of what you would typically call the loop, that are being played by members of the band. Its like we’ve taken over the loop and are now performing the loop, and its not really a loop at all.
Like on Shadows I don’t really play the drum kit at all. I’ve got electronic pads, I’ve got an arcade button box i built (midi controller), and for the entirety of the song I’m just triggering all the sounds that were programmed, and there are no loop beats going on. Mark is playing one of the beats too.
How do you go from what you created in the studio to what you do on stage? How do you decide how will we play this live?
Thats a few days per song process it seems like. We got up in the barn about a month before the tour and just went through song by song and worked it out. If you watch some of these new songs, you’ll see everyone is multi-tasking, and theres not really a lot of moments where anyone is just standing around with nothing to do.
We really wanted everyone to be involved in all the sounds. I’ve got the Protools file opened up and we’re going through and listening to each part, because a lot of times 1,000 sounds will go into the record and by the time its mixed maybe only 250 of those sounds are really out front in the mix. So we go through and solo stuff and figure out what we are going to do live. I know what Drum parts were played and Dave and Jack and Mark know what Guitar parts were played, so its about going “okay so who is free in the bridge to do this synth”? Everything else we give to Mike D. and Hogan. It’s just time and effort, and then playing it over and over again.
We love Korg Nano keys. We’ve got like 20 of them, and they are all spread out over the stage. There’s times where Mark walks back to the drumset and theres a Nano Key there and he’s playing synth parts that are running off Sylenth on my computer. There’s stuff all over the stage to give people the ability at any moment to play those parts of the song.
At what point in the demoing and recording process do you guys bring the loops in?
We’ll for this record it was first, it started with loops. It started with Reason files that if you listen to them by themselves sound like techno instrumental things and we used those as the foundations for writing the lyrics.
This album doesn’t really feel like a post-production album it really does feel like the loops are part of the band.
Thanks, that’s what we were hoping for.
What was the coolest new thing you guys did for this record?
The robot. Have you seen Steve the robot? You know we’re talking about all this layering and there were a lot of drum sets going on in the record doing al ot of parts, and pretty much during the making of the record the question was asked so what are we gonna do about these parts?
Everyone was pretty sad, like- “We aren’t just gonna track this are we?” Theres gotta be something and I jokingly said I’m gonna build a robot.
I think when you say robot everyone thinks humanoid, something that looks like c-3po… but in my head i think of the BestBuy vending machine you see at the airport, thats a robot. Something taking a task that takes a lot of people to accomplish and it does it for them.
So when I’m thinking of a drummer robot I’m thinking of a player piano, this will be a player piano but a player drummer, like auto-drums kinda thing. I just wanted something that would play those other beats on an acoustic drum set and kinda be a visual representation of those beats, but still sound like a machine.
I posted this video of steve and the website Hackaday ended up re-posting the video. It’s funny to me reading the comments on Hackaday because a lot of the comments are “you know if you put some error in there and like changed the velocities it would sound more human.”
But my thing is – “Why would I want my Robot to sound more Human?”
We would play it if we wanted it human. I want it sound like a machine gun. You know really stiff, really technical. And it works better on some stuff than others.
You know Solomon from Family force 5? We were talking at a conference the other day and he was saying that it is beautiful because you don’t always need velocity. Some of the best beats don’t have velocity. Thats the joy of the 808 stuff. The original 808 drum machine had 3 steps of velocity but most of the beats are just full on.
Yeah most people can’t walk away from a record and say they built a robot.
Yeah i do have to give credit to these two engineering students in Waco that are friends of mine (Eli Hernandez and Josh Caldwell). I went to their school during their breaks over two months and they machined the metal parts and turn rough sketches into real designs. They are great.
What tools do you use to create and use loops?
Well i think it is still the trifecta: Ableton, Reason and Protools.
I think I’m kinda getting away from Reason, not for any reason other then I’m starting to get into VST synth stuff like the Sylenth thing is incredible. I’m also getting more into protools because I’m trying to spend more time making stuff out of recorded sounds. Those are the three main ones.
There’s a group called D16 group, they make these really sweet drum machines and plug-ins. You know in Reason on the Scream Distortion how one of the settings is “Digital” the 8-bit degradation thing, they’ve got one called “Decimort” thats really great. It reminds me of some of the Owl-City stuff where its like some of the drum sounds seem to be out of phase, like the bit-rate has been dropped just a hair, this Decimort thing is pretty close to that sound, I’m really into that.
Whats the one piece of Gear, Hardware or Software that you can’t live without? If you had one piece of Gear you could take with you on a Desert Island, what would it be?
My laptop. I guess that’s kinda cheating but.. thats my desert island gear. Or you know one of the new Miko’s would be cool. It’s like the computer and everything you need in there. I don’t know though my laptop is cool because I can do everything on it and take it anywhere. I don’t even have a desktop computer – its my laptop. I plug it into Pro tools and its my full on recording system.
This wraps up part 3 of our Interview with Bwack. If you missed Part 1 or Part 2 make sure to check them out! If you’d like to stay up to date with what’s happening with Loops in Worship, sign up to join our Mailing List, to the right of this post. Also while you’re here check out the rest of what we have to offer. And as always feel free to drop us an email if you’d like!
Will Doggett is a certified Ableton Live Instructor, musician, worship leader and educator based out of FL. He currently works in the Worship Ministry at Calvary Chapel Fort Lauderdale and teaches Ableton Live and Ensemble courses at Ocean's Edge School of Worship . You can reach him by Email and find him on Twitter @willdoggett. He's currently available for consultation and training for churches and musicians interesting in learning to integrate Live into their setups. Want more info? Shoot him an Email!
Interview with @theBwack (pt.3 ) Behind the Scenes of "Church Music" and the Crowder Band
Posted by Will in Chatter
Here’s part three of our interview with @thebwack. We chat about the making of Church Music and how the Crowder Band approaches using loops. Before you check out the article make sure to check out Part 1, and Part 2.
What role do loops play in the Crowder Band? How do you guys treat the idea of using loops?
It’s totally different for every song. I think our philosophy is that we’re going to try and perform as much as we can live. For me as a drummer its just another way of looking at drums. I guess for me the role is subdivisions, its like adding a whole lot of cool subdivisions, and layers. You know in the studio I really like the sound of two or three drumsets all playing at once, so alot of times the loop is either other drum kit parts i’ve recorded or extra beats that I’ve programmed. Alot of it is just trying to get that electronic or urban sound. And for me its a way to play on the beat a little more.. I don’t want to feel restricted to the feeling that if I’m not laying down the backbeat, no one is. I want to feel like if I want to go away from that and not lay down that strong backbeat I know that the loop is providing that.
This record is kinda the first record where we are really starting to blur the line between the drummer and the band and the loops. The way we are performing it, there’s really not that division anymore. There are so many elements of what you would typically call the loop, that are being played by members of the band. Its like we’ve taken over the loop and are now performing the loop, and its not really a loop at all.
Like on Shadows I don’t really play the drum kit at all. I’ve got electronic pads, I’ve got an arcade button box i built (midi controller), and for the entirety of the song I’m just triggering all the sounds that were programmed, and there are no loop beats going on. Mark is playing one of the beats too.
How do you go from what you created in the studio to what you do on stage? How do you decide how will we play this live?
Thats a few days per song process it seems like. We got up in the barn about a month before the tour and just went through song by song and worked it out. If you watch some of these new songs, you’ll see everyone is multi-tasking, and theres not really a lot of moments where anyone is just standing around with nothing to do.
We really wanted everyone to be involved in all the sounds. I’ve got the Protools file opened up and we’re going through and listening to each part, because a lot of times 1,000 sounds will go into the record and by the time its mixed maybe only 250 of those sounds are really out front in the mix. So we go through and solo stuff and figure out what we are going to do live. I know what Drum parts were played and Dave and Jack and Mark know what Guitar parts were played, so its about going “okay so who is free in the bridge to do this synth”? Everything else we give to Mike D. and Hogan. It’s just time and effort, and then playing it over and over again.
We love Korg Nano keys. We’ve got like 20 of them, and they are all spread out over the stage. There’s times where Mark walks back to the drumset and theres a Nano Key there and he’s playing synth parts that are running off Sylenth on my computer. There’s stuff all over the stage to give people the ability at any moment to play those parts of the song.
At what point in the demoing and recording process do you guys bring the loops in?
We’ll for this record it was first, it started with loops. It started with Reason files that if you listen to them by themselves sound like techno instrumental things and we used those as the foundations for writing the lyrics.
This album doesn’t really feel like a post-production album it really does feel like the loops are part of the band.
Thanks, that’s what we were hoping for.
What was the coolest new thing you guys did for this record?
The robot. Have you seen Steve the robot? You know we’re talking about all this layering and there were a lot of drum sets going on in the record doing al ot of parts, and pretty much during the making of the record the question was asked so what are we gonna do about these parts?
Everyone was pretty sad, like- “We aren’t just gonna track this are we?” Theres gotta be something and I jokingly said I’m gonna build a robot.
I think when you say robot everyone thinks humanoid, something that looks like c-3po… but in my head i think of the BestBuy vending machine you see at the airport, thats a robot. Something taking a task that takes a lot of people to accomplish and it does it for them.
So when I’m thinking of a drummer robot I’m thinking of a player piano, this will be a player piano but a player drummer, like auto-drums kinda thing. I just wanted something that would play those other beats on an acoustic drum set and kinda be a visual representation of those beats, but still sound like a machine.
I posted this video of steve and the website Hackaday ended up re-posting the video. It’s funny to me reading the comments on Hackaday because a lot of the comments are “you know if you put some error in there and like changed the velocities it would sound more human.”
But my thing is – “Why would I want my Robot to sound more Human?”
We would play it if we wanted it human. I want it sound like a machine gun. You know really stiff, really technical. And it works better on some stuff than others.
You know Solomon from Family force 5? We were talking at a conference the other day and he was saying that it is beautiful because you don’t always need velocity. Some of the best beats don’t have velocity. Thats the joy of the 808 stuff. The original 808 drum machine had 3 steps of velocity but most of the beats are just full on.
Yeah most people can’t walk away from a record and say they built a robot.
Yeah i do have to give credit to these two engineering students in Waco that are friends of mine (Eli Hernandez and Josh Caldwell). I went to their school during their breaks over two months and they machined the metal parts and turn rough sketches into real designs. They are great.
What tools do you use to create and use loops?
Well i think it is still the trifecta: Ableton, Reason and Protools.
I think I’m kinda getting away from Reason, not for any reason other then I’m starting to get into VST synth stuff like the Sylenth thing is incredible. I’m also getting more into protools because I’m trying to spend more time making stuff out of recorded sounds. Those are the three main ones.
There’s a group called D16 group, they make these really sweet drum machines and plug-ins. You know in Reason on the Scream Distortion how one of the settings is “Digital” the 8-bit degradation thing, they’ve got one called “Decimort” thats really great. It reminds me of some of the Owl-City stuff where its like some of the drum sounds seem to be out of phase, like the bit-rate has been dropped just a hair, this Decimort thing is pretty close to that sound, I’m really into that.
Whats the one piece of Gear, Hardware or Software that you can’t live without? If you had one piece of Gear you could take with you on a Desert Island, what would it be?
My laptop. I guess that’s kinda cheating but.. thats my desert island gear. Or you know one of the new Miko’s would be cool. It’s like the computer and everything you need in there. I don’t know though my laptop is cool because I can do everything on it and take it anywhere. I don’t even have a desktop computer – its my laptop. I plug it into Pro tools and its my full on recording system.
This wraps up part 3 of our Interview with Bwack. If you missed Part 1 or Part 2 make sure to check them out! If you’d like to stay up to date with what’s happening with Loops in Worship, sign up to join our Mailing List, to the right of this post. Also while you’re here check out the rest of what we have to offer. And as always feel free to drop us an email if you’d like!
Wills website